Interview: Patricia Brennan

Watch the vibraphonist/composer's new video, "Palo de Oros"!

L-R: Kim Cass, Jon Irabagon, Marcus Gilmore, Mark Shim, Patricia Brennan, Adam O’Farrill, Mauricio Herrera

Book update! I recently appeared on the Notes From an Artist podcast to talk about In the Brewing Luminous: The Life & Music of Cecil Taylor, which is out now. It was a fun conversation, and we got to address a number of subjects related to Taylor and his music. You can listen to it via Apple Podcasts, or any number of other ways, probably.

The book is available from Amazon or directly from the publisher. I thank you in advance for buying it and reading it.

In freelance news, I recently interviewed vocalist Fay Victor for DownBeat about her new album Life is Funny That Way, on which she sings her own lyrics set to tunes by pianist Herbie Nichols. You can read the story on their website.

Vibraphonist and composer Patricia Brennan has a new album called Breaking Stretch coming out in September on pianist Kris Davis’s Pyroclastic label. It features the same players heard on her previous album, 2022’s More Touch (bassist Kim Cass, percussionist Mauricio Herrera and drummer Marcus Gilmore), plus three horn players: Jon Irabagon on alto and sopranino saxes, Mark Shim on tenor sax, and Adam O’Farrill on trumpet and electronics. The first track to be released from the album is “Palo de Oros,” and we’re premiering the video right here in this newsletter! Here it is:

I sent Brennan five questions by email, and she was gracious enough to respond at length and in depth. Here’s that exchange:

How did you get to where you are today? Meaning, how did you become a vibraphonist — was it your first instrument? What was the musical environment you came up in in Mexico like, and what did coming to the US mean for you as a creative artist? 

I was born and raised in a town called Port of Veracruz (in the state of Veracruz). There’s a Mexican marimba culture in this town, amongst other musical traditions including son jarocho, danzón and Cuban son. I can remember seeing marimbists and hearing folkloric marimba music from a very early age. Also, at home, I had a children’s Mexican marimba. However, my first instrument was the piano. I started to play with my grandmother at 3 years old and began formal lessons at 4 years old. I was fortunate that there was a local conservatory just a few blocks away from my house. It was well structured and very strict. They had a whole system designed to train musicians from early childhood all the way up to adults receiving technical degrees in performance and music education or continuing to bachelor level. I started within this system from the beginning. Once I turned 6 years old, I had to choose a second instrument (in addition to piano) and I chose percussion. My decision was influenced by many things.

My dad is an amateur Latin percussionist and would play (still plays) with groups of friends almost every weekend either at our house, local venues or other people’s houses. I used to join him playing small percussion — particularly claves and güiro — from a very early age. We would mostly play Cuban son or salsa songs. I also used to perform with local danzoneras playing güiro. Also, I always was attracted to the percussion/drummer section of all the local bands. My love for rhythm started from a very early age as well as the dance of many traditional and local styles of music.

The curriculum of this conservatory goes parallel to grades in regular school. For example, at 6 years old, it’s considered 1st grade and on this level you have to take solfège, choir, orchestra, and two instruments. When I was 15 years old, I was studying harmony, counterpoint, composition in addition to my two instruments, choir, orchestra, jazz band and more. The idea is to prepare you to either get your technical degree or continue into the bachelor program in the capital of the state.

There are two musical approaches coexisting in my hometown: the music from the streets/popular music and the conservatory. Many people, even though they are not professional musicians, are part of the musical environment. Dance and music are completely intertwined, so almost everyone knows how to dance salsa, danzón, huapango, etc. All these dances mimic the rhythmic structure of the music to the point that the dancer becomes another member of the rhythm section. I was part of this environment since I have memory of it. I believe that this culture creates a deep connection and understanding of the music and its rhythmic structure. This embodiment of rhythm becomes almost visceral and instinctual.

Back at the conservatory, I was being trained as a classic percussionist and also had to play drum set and some Afro-Cuban instruments like conga and Batá. I was introduced to the classical marimba at the age of 16 and later on once I passed to the bachelor level of the conservatory, I was exposed to the vibraphone. Improvisation had already been part of my life for many years but I didn’t think (and still think) that improvisation meant jazz. For me it was a universal language that coexisted amongst all the styles of music I was exposed to.

Before moving to the US, I studied two years at the bachelor level of the conservatory and also became a member of one of the two top orchestras in the country: Xalapa Symphony Orchestra and the Minería Symphony Orchestra (the latter only happened during summer season in Mexico City). I also competed in marimba competitions and was admitted to a few summer programs overseas; for example, I was part of the Texas Music Festival where I spent one month at the University of Houston. During this time I was one of seven finalists in their concerto competition (out of 200 participants), playing a marimba concerto. I also became one of the founding members of the then Youth Orchestra of the Americas (now called the Orchestra of the Americas). This orchestra is formed by selecting musicians from all over the Americas.

As a member of this orchestra I worked with musicians like Yo-Yo Ma, Paquito D’Rivera and conductors like Leonardo Slatkin and Gustavo Dudamel. It was through this experience that I was able to get the opportunity to audition for the Curtis Institute of Music. After two years of college in Mexico and those other experiences, I moved to Philadelphia to attend the Curtis Institute of Music. At this point I was in search of developing as a musician to the highest level possible. I felt like if I were to stay in Mexico at that time, I would not have been able to achieve this. Many musicians my age or older needed to leave in order to continue to grow and to find greater challenges. As soon as the opportunity to attend Curtis came up, I didn’t hesitate. This migration meant freedom to pursue my dreams. Simultaneously the social environment in Mexico in general was becoming more and more dangerous and unpredictable. Moving to the US also meant safety and freedom of living a better life. 

The ensemble on this record is an expansion of the group heard on your previous album, More Touch. How did you first choose those musicians — Kim Cass, Mauricio Herrera and Marcus Gilmore — and what made you decide you needed horn players (and these horn players in particular) for the new music?

For the album More Touch, the inspiration was the idea of a percussion quartet within the context of jazz and improvised music. Percussion quartet music was one of my passions when at Curtis. Also, being a part of the percussion section of all the musical traditions growing up has always been part of my identity. I wanted to honor that with the music of More Touch. So, the band that came to mind was a vibraphone trio with the addition of a percussionist. However, all the members were considered percussionists including the bass player, therefore a percussion quartet.

Kim Cass is not only one of my favorite bass players but he truly thinks like a drummer. As a bass player, his rhythmic sensitivity and approach is unmatched. Mauricio Herrera brings the connection to the music from my childhood to the table. I’ve known him since I moved to NY (2009). His knowledge of the Afro-Cuban tradition is incredibly vast. His touch on the instrument reflects the depth of his knowledge and the depth of that tradition. He’s one of my favorite Afro-Cuban percussionists. We also have common experiences due to the fact that he also lived in Mexico for a period of time. I met Marcus Gilmore about 11 years ago. We were playing in Vijay Iyer’s large ensemble “Open City”. I’ve been wanting to work with him again since. He is one of the most creative and talented drummers of our time. Also one of my favorite drummers. In addition to their skills, those three guys are some of the best humans around.

Now, with Breaking Stretch, the concepts behind it are expansion, pushing limits to a breaking point, stretching compositional spaces. Part of the expansion meant to add more members to the ensemble. I decided on three horns because I wanted to add more depth to the harmonic and melodic layers of the group. I was also inspired by rhythmically driven bands that I grew up listening to such as Fania All Stars and brass rock bands like Chicago. In those bands, each player was an integral part of the band’s rhythmic identity — and each had both the opportunity and responsibility to be a rhythmic force inside the music. Breaking Stretch expands on the percussive and rhythmic signature of my More Touch quartet. So, just like on More Touch, I wanted to choose horn players that were incredibly rhythmic.

I met Adam O’Farrill in the same band that I met Marcus. Also, we have played in many other groups as sidepeople throughout the years. He’s one of my favorite trumpet players. He’s not only incredibly virtuosic but also an incredibly rhythmic player. I met Mark Shim in the same band as Marcus and Adam. Since then, I knew I wanted to work with him. His sound on the instrument and creative improvisational approach are so unique. In my opinion, he’s one of the best tenor saxophonists of now. Also, he’s a rhythmic force. Lastly, I met Jon Irabagon while playing in Matt Mitchell’s large ensemble project. He’s such an incredibly talented multireedist. I’m always in awe of what he can do. I truly believe he can play anything. It was important for me to form this band with musicians that I admire, respect and that inspire me with what they do and who they are as musicians and humans. The music was written with all of them in mind. 

What is your compositional process like? Do you compose on mallet instruments, or on piano, or in some other way? And what was your approach to this album — were you striving for one thing throughout, or writing one tune at a time until you said, “OK, that’s an album’s worth of music,” or something else entirely?

My compositional process varies. Sometimes it stems from free improvisations, other times from more structured sources such as mathematical formulas, shapes or specific limitations or concepts. There are times that I write at the piano, others on mallets and sometimes I just hear it in my head and sing it/whistle it and go with the flow. When the opportunity for a project surfaces, one of the first steps is to think of the big picture. Sometimes, I start by reviewing my ideas — I keep random ideas in a music notebook, composition notebook and an iPad program. These notes range from drumbeats to a chord progression or an incomplete multi-measure idea.

When I was writing for Breaking Stretch, I started with several concepts that I thought would work well with the concept of expansion as well as keeping the rhythmic essence of the music. For example, the composition “Manufacturers Trust Company Building” was inspired by the sculpture Golden Arbor by Harry Bertoia. This sculpture is one of the most powerful things I’ve ever seen: every surface is worked. It’s composed of multiple shapes of metal of different sizes, thickness and texture. It’s dense and visually “loud”.

The composition was meant to honor the size, the weight, and the profundity of this masterpiece with its plethora of shapes, textures and tones. I stared to play around with angularity by using large intervals and angular rhythms. In addition to that, the rhythm section was meant to give the illusion of a machine in motion. The metal from the sculpture felt very cold and industrial so I wanted to reflect that in the music as well. However, I still wanted it to groove, so I also drew inspiration from Latin rock bands that managed to be heavy but still groove from the core. Each composition is a journey on its own, so the compositional process ends up being very unique to the composition. The process becomes the means to a goal and sometimes in order to get to that goal I have to create a new way to get there, a new compositional process. Ultimately, I always remind myself to follow my ear and my instinct and let the music guide me. 

I’m very curious about the particular effects you use on your vibes — when did you first start using pedals, what sort of pedal board do you have, and how does that factor into your writing? 

I first started using guitar pedals in 2017. However, I’ve been wanting to have this setup for longer than that but I literally couldn’t afford it. So when I finally saved enough money I went ahead and got it. My passion for pedals and electronics began with my mom and her obsession with Jimi Hendrix. It was because of her that I became obsessed as well and would always pay attention to the sounds guitarists would get from then on. Simultaneously, as a classical percussionist I was introduced to the electronic music of Edgard Varèse, Karlheinz Stockhausen, György Ligeti and others. As a percussionist, electronic music immediately becomes a whole vocabulary of new sounds that I want to have access to. One of the goals of adding pedals to my setup was indeed to expand the sonic vocabulary of my instruments. It allowed me to access sounds that would have been impossible to achieve acoustically.

I use a system called K & K vibraphone amplification system that allows me to run the sound of the vibraphone through guitar pedals. Also, all the recordings I’ve done also involve the sound of the amp. The amp becomes a huge part in the overall sound of the vibraphone when all the layers are mixed at the end. My pedal board changes a lot but I have a couple pedals I always keep in the roster. I always keep my Whammy pedal on the board, mostly because it allows me to expand the range of the vibraphone from three octaves to five or more. Also, it allows me to bend the pitch electronically. Even though pitch bending is an acoustic technique on vibraphone, it could be very limited. By doing it with the Whammy pedal, it gives me the freedom to bend pitch in other contexts that wouldn’t normally be possible acoustically.

When I use pedals, I want to make sure it enhances the instrument and expands its performance possibilities rather than just being a gimmick. The approach to the instrument changes completely and you have to think of yourself as a multi-instrumentalist. Even though my natural approach to playing is polyphonic in the sense of considering different roles within a single line, pedals accentuate and enhance that approach. I certainly consider these new sounds during my compositional process. They become another layer of the music. 

The bass solo that kicks off the track we’re premiering, “Palo de Oros,” was that in the score or was it improvised by Kim Cass? And in general, how tightly scored is this music? It’s complexly arranged, but it still feels like there’s air in the room, so where do you draw the line?

The opening bass solo is completely improvised by the amazing Kim Cass. He then eventually connects into the opening line of the composition which Jon Irabagon and I then play after one full cycle. A balance between through-composed material and improvisation is very important for me. However, for me, both come from the same place. The scores are very detailed, from the drum beat — which I consider more as a rhythmic clave for the drummer to build upon — to dynamics and phrasing. However, I write the music from a place that feels improvisational. My goal is for the composition to set the tone as to what the improvisational space is going to be so when the improvisation happens it doesn’t sound disconnected. The performers are a key part of making this happen. We all have to be incredibly open and sensitive to the tone that’s being set by the spirit of the composition. Even though it is complex music, it draws from common denominators that are grounded and can be relatable to anyone. This approach has been always part of my process. I had spent my whole life thinking about what it is that makes music connect to people, no matter the style or complexity. I try to focus on those common denominators and hope that they come through my music. Ultimately, music is about connection not only amongst musicians but also with the universe and everyone else. 

That’s it for now. See you next week!